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 Posted 8/12/2006 8:48:58 PM |
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I was just reading through a discussion on another site about acclimation, and it seems quite a few people are just floating the bag to equalize temp, and introducing the coral/fish without acclimation, I've always believed that a drip acclimation was necessary to equalize PH and salinity. Some of the reasons for the float and drop method make sense. Like for instance, low PH in the bag makes ammonia less toxic and raising the PH could make the ammonia more toxic and do more harm than good ( wouldnt adding an ammonia binder eliminate this concern, or would this be more stressful?  . Please Anthony what is your take on this method? How much salinity change do you feel a coral can handle, also PH change?
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________- David -
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| Posted 8/13/2006 4:13:36 PM |
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| it depends ont he source of the fishes and circumstances. As a rule (as defined by fish pathologists Gratzek and Blasiola) you want to get your fishes out of the bag ASAP. The rush is the lesser of two evils. And for fishes held in extended transit (low pH, high Ammonium), then a slow drip or mixing of water/acclimation may cause permeant damage, undue stress or even kill them (the prolonged exposure to poor water quality and the sudden increase in Ammonia as you convert Ammonium from the increasing pH from mixed/dripping water). I am not a fan of slow acclimation under most any circumstance other than fast transit in good water quality with time as a luxury. Even then you have the added stress and oxygen deprivation of the frightened/trapped specimen in the bag. Put another way... if you were living in an increasingly more noxious environment, would you rather get a breath of clean, healthy air ASAP or work towards it more slowly? That all said... floating the bags is also a bad idea. It terrifies fish to be in a vulnerable position at the surface of the water even if not under bright lights (yikes!) and there is often contaminants (or even disease) from the surfaces that the fish bag has contacted in transit from the source (tables, boxes, etc of fish dealers with a range of new, sick, stressed, fishes and their water everywhere). Rinse the outside of the bag or simply acclimate in a bucket (dim room lights) instead.
. Anthony Calfo
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| Posted 8/13/2006 6:02:20 PM |
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Thank you Anthony, and on a Sunday. Apparently I've been misinformed, and this might help to explain some coral losses. For some reason I thought a rapid salinity change would detrimental, and a long drip acclimation was the way to go. I havent found an LFS yet that maintains salinity anywhere near to mine which is 1.026. As a matter of fact I've found that the LFS SG is rarely the same. I've actually had to alert that their systems were either extremely high or low at times. How much SG change would you expect a coral or fish could handle without being killed? Here's an example the LFS had a new guy mix salt for a large water change and the water was 1.035 when they were done ( yes this happened ). How would you recommend I acclimate a new coral?
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________- David -
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| Posted 8/13/2006 7:17:09 PM |
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Coming home from the LFS is a short drive, the water in the bag isn't going to be suffering much int he way of degraded water quality. I would acclimate slowly.
I never do temp separately; I just let the temp also adjust slowly as I drip into a bucket.
Don't count your gobies before they've metamorphosized.
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| Posted 8/13/2006 8:08:49 PM |
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| I agree with the keeping of coral systems at full strength seawater.. around 1.245 1.026 is getting too high IMO (less dissolved oxygen) As for slow versus fast changes... the arguments about corals being sensitive to salinity changes is laughable for most species in the trade which are or can be (species but not necessarily your specimen) intertidal!!! Good heaven's... every day on the reef, tides go out and in, extremes of heat... rainfall (freshwater!) on exposed corals (low tide) during winter/rainy seasons... puh-lease  What is the basis of argument for these species not being able to take slight changes in salinity? Your information is mistaken here too my friend. Its nearly the same story for fishes (lesser eveil to get them in faster as defined by rates of mortality and morbidity... some whoesalers literally track this on their computers). Some inverts like shrimps, however, that do nto ever see intertidal exposure and are not tolerant of it will need a slower acclimation indeed. But even then we are talking about 5-15 minutes... not longer. Its more harm than good to keep your creatures in the shipping bad (stress if not water quality)
. Anthony Calfo
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| Posted 8/14/2006 5:37:16 AM |
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| Anthony: i think i lost some sand sifting starfish from a too fast acclimation when i got my first tank. i floated the bags and then just put them in. they kind of curled up shortly after. one of four survived. in your book, which i read later, don't you say a slower acclimation for seastars and mollusks is needed? my local dealer was just telling me the other day that he was getting a new shipment in and would be there all night accimating the fish. i will have to ask him what the technique is.
------------------------------------
Carl-
We are all stardust
Sun powered reef
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| Posted 8/14/2006 10:40:02 AM |
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| let's be clear here my friends... we have three folks talking about three different things here. Fishes... corals... non-cnidarian invertebrates. I make distinctions in my posts as well. And what serves the greater group for one group of animals may not for another (case in point... get fish and corals in to tanks ASAP while taking as much time as you can afford on Echinos and Arthropods, eg) It is innacurate and unrealistic to make a blanket statement for acclimation for all major groups and dozens of families. Impossible. Eve among corals we must discuss dry shipping versus wet shipping. And with dry shipping being so very successful for so many, does that not throw the/your whole "slow acclimation" concerns/arguments out the window? ")
. Anthony Calfo
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| Posted 8/14/2006 2:40:58 PM |
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| Maybe I shouldve been alittle more wordy in my original post and mentioned something regarding seastars. As you already pointed out these do require a long acclimation. My question was definately directed towards fish and corals. I'm alittle confused on the SG I researched and at the time an experts advice was 1.026 is NSW SG. Are you recommending going alittle lower because the dissolved oxygen is higher, and thats an acceptable level, or is the salinity on an Indo-Pacific reef 1.024?
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________ - David -
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| Posted 8/14/2006 2:55:53 PM |
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| Posted 8/14/2006 3:21:19 PM |
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